carnageX
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Post by carnageX on Sept 8, 2008 15:18:41 GMT -5
Yet another reason for me to hate Apple...wow...seriously that's terrible for such a big company to do that and not give any royalties to the original creator... Apple fanatics can't really complain about M$ copying Mac now can they? lol Seeing as Apple's biggest thing was, well, stolen .
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Post by RoGeR on Sept 8, 2008 17:22:51 GMT -5
WoW! Same here another reason to hate the Apple... but mate I'm trying to click on the link in the quote not working
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carnageX
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Post by carnageX on Sept 8, 2008 18:44:01 GMT -5
Oops lol...there, links fixed.
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~CrAzY~™
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Post by ~CrAzY~™ on Sept 8, 2008 22:36:57 GMT -5
I hate companies like Apple. >.< They show no appreciation and stomp on whatever and whoever they want to get their products sold. What's $10 million to a company like Apple?
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Post by RoGeR on Sept 9, 2008 3:29:38 GMT -5
True very true,,, arghhh I just hate apple whatever they do I hate them.. stuck up
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 10, 2008 6:11:53 GMT -5
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Post by carnageX on Sept 10, 2008 7:49:25 GMT -5
If the article is accurate...then he did patent it, but the patent ran out and he didn't have the money to renew it.
I don't care as much that apple used his design, if they indeed did. But to not give him ANY recognition or royalties at all...that's just sick.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 11, 2008 4:45:25 GMT -5
Why should they owe him anything? He didn't pay to renew the patent, so he loses out. Thats how the world works.
And what about all the other MP3 players out there? Zune? Zen? Should the manufacturers of those pay him too?
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carnageX
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Post by carnageX on Sept 11, 2008 7:49:37 GMT -5
If it were you in his shoes, I'm sure you'd like a little recognition for what you did.
If he were to go after those companies, then yes. The article is about Apple using his blueprints to possibly make the iPod; unless the others looked at his blueprints as well, then it doesn't really concern them.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 11, 2008 9:58:19 GMT -5
Looking at the blueprints, only thing I can see that is similar is the screen placement. But all MP3 players have that. I don't see a click wheel on that.
OMG COMPUTERS ALL HAVE MONITORS. AND KEYBOARDS. Someone should sue all computer manufacturers.
Don't see how the hell that guy can expect to get anything from that.
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carnageX
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Post by carnageX on Sept 11, 2008 11:56:03 GMT -5
Looking at the blueprints, only thing I can see that is similar is the screen placement. But all MP3 players have that. I don't see a click wheel on that. Early design/prototype. Ever pop open like a flat panel monitor that you get from Dell or HP, etc etc? It's usually just a re-branded LG, Samsung, etc. The OEM just sold it to the computer companies, but its still their chipset/parts.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 12, 2008 14:30:41 GMT -5
Thats not what I'm saying.
That guy is asking for money for the basic idea for portable media players. What I said is appropriate seeing as a monitor and keyboard are basic things a computer would need. So yeh... he shouldn't get anything for making the basic idea of portable media. He didn't expand on his idea enough, so he loses out.
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Post by RoGeR on Sept 12, 2008 15:57:38 GMT -5
Simie... man whatever ur saying I know what u mean it's wrong no matter what NO MATTER what they shoulda give him some not all at least some credit! that's really sick and unfair....
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~CrAzY~™
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Post by ~CrAzY~™ on Sept 12, 2008 23:05:47 GMT -5
It isn't like he invented a tooth pick or a new soda can... Coming up with the iPod design 20 years early is sort of worth recognition and some monetary thanks.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 13, 2008 13:58:42 GMT -5
Simie... man whatever ur saying I know what u mean it's wrong no matter what NO MATTER what they shoulda give him some not all at least some credit! that's really sick and unfair.... What I find funny is that you simply ignore any evidence against what you claim. Did you even look at the threads you created on the other forums? As I said earlier, that design looks only slightly like the iPod. Looks more like the old Zen Micro than any iPod.
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Post by DesertFlame on Sept 13, 2008 17:03:33 GMT -5
Ever pop open like a flat panel monitor that you get from Dell or HP, etc etc? It's usually just a re-branded LG, Samsung, etc. The OEM just sold it to the computer companies, but its still their chipset/parts. Exactly just like how he invented the design of the ipod but apple used there own software and everything so simi is right he shouldnt get any money because hes not the one that designed the software, parts or anything all he did is create a drawing that looks vaguely like the ipod. that's like me drawing a time machine and it gets invented 20 years later, i dint invent the warp coils or what ever the hell it would be made out of so its not my invention.
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carnageX
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Post by carnageX on Sept 13, 2008 18:17:10 GMT -5
As I said earlier, that design looks only slightly like the iPod. Looks more like the old Zen Micro than any iPod. And yet Apple admitted it wasn't their original design . Ever pop open like a flat panel monitor that you get from Dell or HP, etc etc? It's usually just a re-branded LG, Samsung, etc. The OEM just sold it to the computer companies, but its still their chipset/parts. Exactly just like how he invented the design of the ipod but apple used there own software and everything so simi is right he shouldnt get any money because hes not the one that designed the software, parts or anything all he did is create a drawing that looks vaguely like the ipod. that's like me drawing a time machine and it gets invented 20 years later, i dint invent the warp coils or what ever the hell it would be made out of so its not my invention. Technically you could if you patented it. If somebody used the design you made, you would be entitled to royalties, given that you kept renewing your patent, which was what the British man failed to do because of financial difficulties. But seriously, after 10 years of the iPod being out...they NOW admit they took the design? That is epic fail on Apple's part. Simie is right they didn't use the same software; because THE SAME SOFTWARE WASN'T AVAILABLE BACK THEN. Now documents filed by Apple in a court case show the US firm acknowledges him as the father of the iPod. ... Two years ago, Mr Kramer told this newspaper how he had invented and built the device in 1979 – when he was just 23. His invention, called the IXI, stored only 3.5 minutes of music on to a chip – but Mr Kramer rightly believed its capacity would improve.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 14, 2008 7:09:13 GMT -5
They took the general idea of a portable media player, but they took that idea and innovated, did their apple wizardry, and boom, iPod. Every company copies at least one idea, and then builds on it and makes it much better. Microsoft, for example, didn't make the first OS, but looked at another, took the general idea and build their own.
(I'm not saying Apple was the first to make an OS, so don't think I'm implying that. >_>)
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Post by it might be snores on Sept 16, 2008 18:31:38 GMT -5
"apple wizardry" you mean painted it white and took out all the features right?
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 17, 2008 9:17:46 GMT -5
No, in fact I mean they painted it white and added a ton of new features.
The features of this guy... 3.5 mins of audio. Features of iPod... 120GB of storage. 50,000*3.5mins (or so) of audio, video, etc.
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carnageX
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Post by carnageX on Sept 17, 2008 12:03:38 GMT -5
No, in fact I mean they painted it white and added a ton of new features. The features of this guy... 3.5 mins of audio. Features of iPod... 120GB of storage. 50,000*3.5mins (or so) of audio, video, etc. I hope you realize 120GB back in '79 was unheard of...right? 20MB hard drive was huge way back then. 3.5min of audio was most likely a very very good amount for the time back then, considering what kind of technology they had. You have to realize, technology has only really began booming in the last 15-20 years or so.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 18, 2008 1:47:03 GMT -5
That supports my point. How can he claim to have invented the iPod if all the technology used in it was unheard of back then?
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Post by carnageX on Sept 18, 2008 19:26:26 GMT -5
He can claim it..because Apple admitted it. They used his drawing in court to defend themselves against the Burst.com fiasco.
Let me quote parts from the article, ONCE AGAIN, that make my point valid:
So...to sum things up:
Kramer drew up some sketches/blueprints of a media player back in 1979. Developed technology that was good for back then to run it. Skip to Apple - they see the drawings, and base a media player off of Kramer's design: the iPod. Skip forward again - Apple gets sued by Burst.com (not gonna discuss that here, google it if you want more info), and admit (note the emphasis on 'admit') to Kramer being the original "father" in their words, of the iPod. They use his drawings as defense in court against Burst.com. Kramer is NOT suing Apple, nor attempts to do his financial position, BUT, he would like some COMPENSATION for coming up with the idea...which is what this WHOLE THING IS ABOUT. Not whether or not Kramer is or isn't the idea-holder of the iPod: because he is. Apple admitted he is. End of story. This is about him being compensated for his work on it.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 19, 2008 4:29:53 GMT -5
I was sure I replied with something similar to this post... but I can't find it Anyway, if you were Apple, and were being sued by a big company (Burst.com), would you attempt to get round this by "admitting" that someone else created it, so you didn't have to pay either? That is likely to be exactly what Apple did, just to get of the hook.
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carnageX
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Post by carnageX on Sept 19, 2008 7:48:42 GMT -5
Lol you can't accept the fact that maybe he did actually come up with the original idea of the iPod, can you Simie. That'd be too terrible for your beloved company Apple to do something like that!
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 19, 2008 10:09:42 GMT -5
So you're out of arguments then?
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Post by carnageX on Sept 19, 2008 12:05:14 GMT -5
Let's use your previous reply in another situation:
You're in court for homicide. You have evidence you couldn't have comitted the crime of killing someone, by showing a convenience store tape that showed you robbing the place. You're off the hook for murder, right? But you're still liable for the robbery you did.
Same situation pretty much. Apple was being sued by Burst, and they provided evidence that they used a different design (Kramer's)...they're still liable for ADMITTING that they used Kramer's design. And you can't really say "Oh, I was just kidding about those papers we showed you to defend ourselves last time. Those don't count this time, only that time we were in court."
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 19, 2008 14:00:14 GMT -5
But since there is no consequences for saying that they used those plans, it is an excellent way of winning the case and not having to pay a thing to anyone.
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Post by carnageX on Sept 19, 2008 15:19:29 GMT -5
The point I, and the others, are trying to make is this: the guy was pretty much the base unit of the idea. He should at least get some form of compensation.
Think of it this way: if somebody uses your coding you made, in something they did, you'd want some sort of recognition for it or compensation, right? Well legally, they wouldn't have to if you didn't get it officially copyrighted. You can add "Copyright Simie 2008" all you want, but unless you get it official (as in you pay a fee for every bit of code you want copyrighted), it won't matter.
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Simie
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Post by Simie on Sept 19, 2008 15:41:19 GMT -5
You got your copyright laws wrong there. Everything is copyrighted as soon as it is made. (Well, it is at least in the UK, not sure about the US)
If they had a similar function of code, yet it was different and didn't use any of my code, I couldn't do anything about it. He didn't take anything from me, only based his idea on mine. Doesn't mean I should get anything from him.
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